The Father of Online Marketing Speaks - Again!
  

Jay Conrad Levinson - Mr. Guerrilla Marketing - gives TheNetReporter.com an exclusive interview you won't find anywhere else!

I recently caught up again with Jay Conrad Levinson, creator of the Guerilla Marketing series of books, including "Guerrilla Marketing Online" and "Online Marketing Weapons" - two of the original books ever written about marketing on the Internet. 

Widely respected as one of the world's leading authorities on small business and electronic marketing, Jay has over 2 million books in print translated into 37 different languages.

The Net Reporter (TNR) - Your site, www.jayconradlevinson.com, has undergone a major facelift. Gone is the emphasis on providing pages and pages of information and it seems you get straight to the point with every bit of information on the site. 

It's like the difference between night and day in appearance and certainly simpler and much more direct than your www.gmarketing.com site, which you still operate!

TNR - Why the major shift in format?

Jay - Part of what we are doing is testing various types of actions people will take on the site. 

You can see on the website (www.JayConradLevinson.com) that there are several courses of action people can take. 

At the end of a month we’re going to know which ones people are most interested in so we can concentrate our efforts on those. 

We want to see what people will do, and their clicks are the clearest indication of their interests. 

This continual process of testing is something every good marketer with a website must engage in on an ongoing basis.

TNR - Is this an overall trend online right now or are you ahead of the curve?

Jay – I think it is a trend that has been a long time coming. 

People who “grew up” in print and traditional advertising thought that once you had a site up and it was beautiful and complete that you were basically done. 

However, with the constant changes in technology, browser software and surfer behavior, we realized our site couldn’t stay the same – so we’re trying some different things to see what works best.

TNR - Why do you think the "kill them with content" website model is disappearing?

Jay – People are absolutely swamped with information. You literally only have about 3 to 8 seconds to grab their attention and get them to take action or they surf away. 

Every website owner has to put their best foot forward and get the surfer to interact with their site by enticing them to click, sign up or enter a contest. 

You must get them to do something, anything to engage them in your site or you have lost them forever.

TNR - I noticed you are selling tickets to your seminar in Las Vegas. Can you really sell a $2,500 seminar ticket with a one page website?

Jay – That is a question I really wanted to know that answer to myself! 

Would people pay thousands of dollars for a seminar based on a one page website?  

So we decided to test it out and the answer is “NO” – for an item of that size we’ve found you really need a 3 page website! <grin>

Seriously, we added two more pages of information to the offering for the seminar – which is a 1-day “Boot Camp” in Las Vegas 
(Click HERE =====> www.gmarketingbootcamp.com) 
where I will teach business owners the most cutting edge online marketing strategies available. 

Those two additional pages provide information about the event, but the principal of giving people exactly what they want in a straight-forward manner with the fewest number of web pages remains the same.

If people are interested in what you have to say - and if they are interested enough to spend their money or invest their time - then a one page or two page website is your best bet.

It gets people to see what’s in it for them quickly and they can make whatever decisions you want them to make, whether or not to buy your product or service, sign up for your newsletter, subscribe to your ezine, etc.

In this particular case, because the purchase amount is so much higher, we had to add additional information to the site so people could understand the value in our boot camp concept.

The really exciting thing about what we’re doing on this project is that the information these people receive has never been presented anywhere before. Also, all boot camp attendees will receive research results that cost over $200,000 to produce. 

The most unique thing about the event, however, is that every person who leaves this boot camp will leave with an Internet marketing action plan and strategy tailored specifically to their business. We make some very strong guarantees on the website as to the outcomes people can expect if they attend the boot camp.

I’ll be teaching the distilled essence of all the marketing techniques, tools and strategies that are working online and then show people how to apply these to their specific businesses directly and immediately.

So the answer to your question is yes… so far this marketing approach of a website with only a few pages is working and people are signing up at $2,500 each to come to this one day event.

I think it really doesn’t matter how much what you’re selling costs. I believe it comes down to your purpose for your website and how well you communicate that purpose to your potential customers.

TNR - What do you mean the “purpose” of your website?

Jay – Part of our purpose with this new website is to see what specific kinds of actions people will take. We are doing a lot of testing.

For example, here is a test that really took place.

A company was making an offer on their website with a popup window coming up immediately as people arrived at the site. They noticed that a lot of people clicked for more information, but very few people actually bought. 

So they switched it around to use an exit pop-up window that came up as people left the site. The number of clicks on the pop-up for more information went way down, but the total number of orders actually went up! 

So the lesson learned in a month of testing  - a far higher number of people will buy if you put the popup at the end rather than at the beginning of their website visit.

TNR – So an exit pop-up produced better results than an entrance pop-up - in this particular example?

Jay – In that experiment, yes – and most people never realize they should experiment that way.

My website now comprises an ongoing experiment. We intend to learn from it and every week (or at least every month) we will make adjustments based our results.

I think the Internet world is experiencing a major trend toward 1 or 2 page websites… and the whole idea of interactivity has been misused or at least misunderstood so far.  

The word “inter” (meaning between) and “active” (meaning action) has finally been recognized – the web is not just a place to get information. Interactivity means taking action between the two parties. That’s the purpose of any site – to get people to take decisive action!

I know a retailer who uses a website to promote his store but doesn’t want to make sales off the site. Getting people into his store represents his whole purpose in using the site.

TNR – That’s great! He knows his outcome, getting people into the store, because he knows the store means his best opportunity to make a sale.

Jay – But you see… most people don’t know their outcome for their site! They have some vague notions about going online and that commerce is conducted there – but that’s it.

They don’t have a clear and concise goal or objective for their site. As long as you are online you might as well try to make some money – but most sites get put up with any clearly defined purpose.

This retailer’s only goal for his website was directing people to the store – to take the action of going to the showroom.

If your objective is to sell something then you need to set up your site with that objective in mind. Ask yourself how the Internet fits in with your marketing process.

Is it everything?

Are you trying to be like Amazon.com where the entire sale and decision is made online?

Is your objective to get a lead?

What action are you trying to get someone to take?

If you want them to make their entire purchase decision online then a concise, well-crafted one page website epitomizes the way to go. Get to the point and let people know what is in it for them!

TNR – Can you define your site's objective for us?

Jay – When we put up our website in 1995 we were so proud because it was state of the art – then!

It looked good and it offered a lot of lush content along with books for sale – and we sold a TON of books. But overall, in looking back over 6 years, we figured out that you can’t make a lot of money trying to sell books like Amazon - especially not at Amazon prices!

Since we’re in the business of disseminating business information –that’s our core business - through my speaking, seminars, books, coaching and our upcoming “bootcamp” in October as well as our newsletter... we wondered how could we engage in our core business to make money with more than just book sales.

To both prove we could do it, as well as make additional distinctions, we chose to use the marketing of the bootcamp itself as part of the experiment. We are only doing Internet marketing to promote it. Ticket sales and promotion exclusively online with no “traditional” advertising… and so far it appears the results will prove favorable.

If you think about it, using the Internet to attract people who want to know more about it makes complete sense. We don't encounter nearly the resistance because the people who find the site and read it already use the Internet and want to know more about how to use it effectively.

We also help people through our coaching program and we really want to see how people react to the way we present that information on our website. 

When someone needs customized marketing assistance, this program can help them develop and implement their business strategies with personalized assistance from me as well as my team. Determining if people will purchase these types of services from the site is another important part of this ongoing experiment.

So that is how we redefined – or I should say “refined” – the goals for our site and that’s why we have the site structured the way we do. Not only will it help us make money, it will help us predict and adapt to future online trends.

TNR – So, if I’m hearing you correctly, you've set you website up not only to operate your business, but to conduct an ongoing market research study.

Jay – YES! That’s the way it should be - and in fact all website owners should set their sites up to perform as an ongoing market research study. You really hit the nail on the head right there.

Your market research study should never end!

When I worked with Proctor and Gamble they tested their marketing effectiveness on a continuous basis. They measured the effectiveness of their advertising on a scale known in the industry as “Burke Day After Recall”. 

Once they had a measurement of an ad’s effectiveness, every subsequent ad was measured against that scale to see if it was better, worse, or the same.

Their whole purpose became testing and trying to find various ways to improve their results over what they already had.

TNR – And really, the web makes it a lot easier and less expensive for someone to do fairly sophisticated market research and testing just by paying attention to their statistics program. 

With the example of the entrance pop-up vs. the exit pop-up window, someone could do the same experiment just by doing different things and keeping track of the results they got.

For example somebody with a website could run one pop-up window in front of 100 unique visitors and then run it a different way in front of the next 100 visitors and compare the results. 

They would then keep the best and test against that. Every time you test you keep what works and discard what doesn’t work as well.

You get your results a lot faster online because you can watch as it happens. You don’t have to wait for TV, radio or newspaper ads to run.

Jay – That is so on the button! So much of succeeding on the Internet is testing, testing, testing to see what works and what doesn’t.

TNR – So how does someone deal this trend towards never-ending testing combined with a constantly changing Internet landscape?

Jay – We have the website set up now not only to react to what people want, but also to help us see new trends online as they develop.

Nobody can have a perfect website because you can always find a strategy for getting better, more cost-effective results from your online efforts. Avoiding complacency holds the key to dealing with this trend, as well as never falling into the trap of assuming that what you do today will work far into the future.

You have to get in touch with what your target market wants and then watch how they behave on your site – always looking for a better way to engage them and create a relationship with them.

TNR – With the Internet getting so crowded and with so many people competing for the same sets of eyeballs - what types of things do you find sell really well online right now?

Jay – The really big sellers still look like information, travel, books, flowers, music, and some personal business services.

You can divide information and personal services into a lot of different areas such as seminars, information products, newsletters, coaching and a whole lot more. 

TNR - Everybody thought the way to get rich online was to give away piles of information for free. 

Obviously with all the “dot com” failures this strategy doesn’t work! 

Do you still offer any "freebies" on your sites or have you switched everything over to the "pay as you go" model?

Jay – We do still give away a weekly report. 

The entire purpose of anything we give away is to prove to people that we know how to talk about marketing in a way that helps their business AND to get names for our permission marketing mailing list.

When they sign up for the free reports we promise never to abuse the permission they have given us to follow up as new and exciting developments occur. People can sign up for free at http://www.jayconradlevinson.com/JCL_newsletter.htm

TNR – So to wrap things up, what else do you think people could learn from the radical revamping of your website?

Jay- They should learn that the way they started their website isn't necessarily the way they should have it right now. 

There have been a lot of changes in the way people react with the Internet. 

People need to market for the realities of the Internet now – not when they went online. 

In my case I went online in 1995. Jim, you went online in 1997 and the realities for both of us have changed dramatically. No matter who you are, you should reassess what you knew then with what you know now and make the changes to your site.

TNR – So if I’m hearing you right, everyone needs to adapt the mindset of planning for constant change.

Jay – Exactly, along with testing all the time so your changes will reflect the things that work based on concrete results - not based on guessing. 

So your website should produce better revenue for you on a regular basis because you are constantly trying new things, making mistakes, learning what works and making the site perform better and better over time.

The more lessons you learn the more your sites will make you happy -  but even then you will have to keep changing because competition will change, technology will change, and consumers will change.

TNR – So everybody reading this should take notice!

If one of the founding fathers of online marketing isn’t afraid to make 180° degree turns in the middle of the Information Super Highway they shouldn’t hesitate to do the same!

Jay – Exactly! That is just what I did and thank heaven I did it. 

It would have been so easy to get lulled into a sense of security or complacency because we sold a lot of books and that is good enough. 

It’s not good enough! 

We owe it to ourselves, our families and our customers to find new and better ways to conduct business online.

TNR – Jay, I really appreciate your time in giving us this information.

I highly encourage everyone reading this to go take a look at Jay’s websites and compare them.

See the changes he has made and the way he has his information structured. 

I can’t imagine anyone not learning some incredibly valuable lessons just by observing and modeling what one of the world’s greatest marketers does on his site.

For more log on to www.JayConradLevinson.com, www.gmarketingbootcamp.com and www.gmarketing.com.